Re: [cc65] ca65 for stand-alone asm projects

Hi!

On Wed, Nov 03, 2010 at 10:57:45PM +0100, Oliver Schmidt wrote:
> One can argue that the same should be possible for a single asm file
> too - and implementing the C main() in asm and linking with the C
> startup code is not what I'm talking about here ;-))
>
> I do *not* want to say that the cc65 toolchain should focus on that
> scenario. I just want to point out that the complexity isn't really
> problem domain immanent but rather induced by the toolchain.

As I see it and as I've written in my last mail, what people expect is not so
much formed by what does make sense or what is possible on other platforms,
but what they're used to ON THIS SPECIFIC PLATFORM. This explains for example
that C programs for the C64 written by people new to cc65 are full of PEEKs
and POKEs (and actually one of the most common questions is "how to I
peek/poke with cc65"). To have even a simple BASIC program do anything C64
specific, one needs PEEK and POKE. So people translate this knowledge to cc65
when they start.

This is true for other things as well: In the CBM world, having to start
loaded code with SYS is not uncommon, so this is accepted as uncomfortable but
necessary. Adding a BASIC header or an autostart is nice to have but people
know what to do if it's not there.

Things are different when it comes to the load address, and this is why people
get so upset: They're used so much to having it supplied automatically, that
they don't even think about it any more. As a consequence, ca65 is bad - not
because it really is, but because it doesn't live up to the expectations.

So I do also expect that adding a BASIC header by default, so people could
start asm programs with RUN, would make them upset. Not so much because it
isn't useful, but because they aren't used to it.

Regards


        Uz


-- 
Ullrich von Bassewitz                                  uz@musoftware.de
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